Ep69: Why Human-Centred Leadership Drives Business Growth with Finesse Blumenthal
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Can you really put people first and still deliver ambitious commercial growth, or is that the wrong question entirely?
In this episode of Human Wise, Helen Wada is joined by transformational Chief People Officer, entrepreneur and human capital growth strategist Finesse Blumenthal to explore why human-centred leadership and business performance belong together. Drawing on her experience working with high-growth organisations, executive teams and boards, Finesse challenges the idea that leaders must choose between caring about people and delivering results.
Together, Helen and Finesse explore how listening, trust, accountability and meaningful development translate into commercial value. They discuss the role of human skills in an AI-enabled workplace, how people leaders can build stronger business cases for investment, and why leaders need to create a safety net that gives people the confidence to stretch themselves. Finesse also shares her unconventional journey into executive leadership and why she believes relationships, reinvention and the courage to step into the unknown can transform both careers and organisations.
Topics Discussed:
Why people should never be treated simply as resources
What should remain distinctly human as AI reshapes work
Why human-centred leadership and commercial performance belong together
Turning listening into action and measurable business value
Making the business case for investing in people and human skills
Why HR and people leaders need to speak the language of the business
Finesse's unconventional journey into executive leadership
Creating trust by giving people a safety net to experiment and grow
Why stretching people requires both ambitious targets and strong coaching
Preparing the next generation with relationship, communication and commercial skills
Timestamps:
00:00 - 04:37 | Meet Finesse Blumenthal
04:38 - 07:02 | What Does It Mean to Be Human at Work in the Age of AI?
07:03 - 12:00 | The Human Skills That Create Business Value
12:01 - 17:53 | Making the Commercial Case for Investing in People
17:54 - 22:17 | Getting Leadership and Board Buy-In
22:18 - 26:03 | Finesse's Unconventional Journey to the C-Suite
26:04 - 31:37 | “I See You, and I Got You”
31:38 - 34:48 | Stretching People Without Losing the Human Connection
34:49 - 38:09 | Human Skills in an AI-Enabled Future
38:10 - 40:46 | Finesse's Tip and Question for Leaders
Read the episode blog here
About the Finesse Blumenthal:
Follow @finesseb on Linkedin
Finesse Blumenthal is a transformational Chief People Officer, entrepreneur and human capital growth strategist with experience helping high-growth organisations scale, transform and integrate.
Her approach brings together people and commercial performance, helping organisations build the leadership, capability and culture needed to grow. Finesse is passionate about relationships, reinvention and helping people recognise what they are capable of achieving. Her own unconventional path to executive leadership has shaped her belief in the importance of confidence, connection and creating opportunities for people to develop.
She is particularly passionate about helping younger people build the human and commercial skills that are rarely taught formally, including communication, networking, relationship-building and business development.
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[00:00:00]
[00:00:29] Welcome and Setup
[00:00:29] Helen Wada: welcome to another episode of Human Why.
[00:00:34] Meet Vanessa in Atlanta
[00:00:34] Helen Wada: Excited to have Vanessa Blumenthal join me this afternoon, or this morning, 'cause you're on the other side of the pond, Vanessa.
[00:00:43] Helen Wada: Tell us,
[00:00:43] Finesse Blumenthal: my morning. Love it
[00:00:45] Helen Wada: t- tell us where you are exactly
[00:00:47] Speaker 4: I am in Atlanta, Georgia
[00:00:49] Helen Wada: Fantastic. And sunny, warm. I expect you've still got the heat down there right now, right?
[00:00:55] Speaker 5: Absolutely, and absolutely love the heat. Yeah, it's... I, I don't want it to go away.
[00:00:59] Helen Wada: We, we [00:01:00] can't complain. We've had a great summer over here in the UK.
[00:01:02] Bio and Show Theme
[00:01:14] Helen Wada: Um, just for the listeners, a little bit of your professional bio and then we're talking about being human, so I'm gonna come to you and, and get you to talk a little bit about who, who is Finesse behind the, the professional bio. But just by way of background, you are a transformational chief people officer, entrepreneur, and human capital growth strategist, having worked in a number of professional service firms, cloud-based organizations, that real front end entrepreneurial organizations that are striving for growth, that are acquiring new businesses, that are moving into new markets.
[00:01:38] Helen Wada: And when we first connected two, three years ago now, I think what struck me was the commercial nature of where you come from, the sort of linking in that human capital piece to commercial growth, and that's really what's brought us here to the table today to have the conversation. Because, what, what Being Human Wise is all about is not about one or the other, it's about [00:02:00] how can we blend commerciality with humanity.
[00:02:04] Helen Wada: And I, I seen what you do that in, in spades and, and love the journey that you've been on, so wanted to give you an opportunity to share it with the listeners that we have. So welcome to the show. We're talking about being human. Tell us a little bit more about you
[00:02:20] Speaker 5: Sure. Absolutely, and it's such an honor, and I'm so excited to, to do this with you today.
[00:02:25] Vanessa Beyond the Title
[00:02:25] Speaker 5: so I'm not the most conventional chief people officer. I'm not sure what that exactly means, but my path certainly has not been linear. I've been always been fascinated by people, what makes them believe in themselves particularly, what creates trust, and what allows someone to perform beyond what they thought was possible.
[00:02:44] Speaker 5: That's the exciting part for me. I think there's so many people that don't understand the power that they have professionally, I've spent most of my career helping help, as you said, high growth organizations scale, transform, and integrate.
[00:02:56] Speaker 5: But outside of the title, I am, as [00:03:00] you said, an entrepreneur, a relationship builder, a mentor, a mother and someone who believes in deeply reinvention, constant reinvention. I believe humanity, it's all about continuing to evolve and reinvent yourself. My own journey has taught me that where someone begins does not determine where they go.
[00:03:20] Speaker 5: I didn't follow a traditional path into executive leadership. I had to learn how to build confidence, relationships, and credibility as I went. That's the one reason why I'm passionate about helping specifically younger people develop human skills that are rarely taught in school, how to connect, communicate, build relationships, and create opportunity.
[00:03:37] Speaker 5: Because whether that's in your personal life or your professional life, that is the number one skill that is needed in this world right now
[00:03:44] Helen Wada: I, I hear it, it really connects with, with what we're talking about and, and the work that we do at The Human Advantage because it is... it's almost going back to basics, but it... We'll dig into your story a bit in a moment, and what you did, how did you learn some of those skills, [00:04:00] and, and what can others learn from you?
[00:04:02] Human at Work in AI
[00:04:02] Helen Wada: But I always love to start these podcasts with a question, and in the age of AI, you talk about the, the skills of, of humanity. But what does it really mean to be human at work? We're sat here, it's September 2026. AI has been... is, in use a lot more across organizations. People are starting to play with it, use it, really drive business decisions.
[00:04:28] Helen Wada: So where does humanity at work come in?
[00:04:30] Speaker 5: Oh, that's... Oh, yes, that's as you can see on some of my posts, one of my favorite things to talk about. And before we go into AI, because there's like there's a lot to unpack there, I, I'd like to just take a step back and kind of talk about what it means, at least from my perspective, to be human at work.
[00:04:48] Speaker 5: And I think that that really is the foundation when we're talking about bringing any, any technology any advancements. The human element is always going to be there, and to me, it's [00:05:00] remembering that people are simply not resources. So when we're looking at AI, the numbers, the roles on a spreadsheet, it's...
[00:05:06] Speaker 5: They're, these are individuals, humans that are carrying ambition, fear, potential, family responsibilities, and experiences that we will never fully see. And I don't think it's about, it's not about lowering standards or avoiding accountability. In fact, I think real humanity requires honesty and people do want accountability.
[00:05:25] Speaker 5: And so I, I wanna just to start there because the human element cannot be, put to the side as we talk about artificial intelligence,
[00:05:33] Helen Wada: Hmm.
[00:05:34] Speaker 5: 'cause there's the human intelligence piece. AI right now, I think in the world is, is asking us, it's forcing us to ask much more about the fundamental question which jobs will disappear.
[00:05:44] Speaker 5: At least that's what people are, are thinking in their heads on all different levels. I think the better question is what work should remain distinctly human, and how do we redesign organizations around that? How do we take our talents and resources that we have, that we've [00:06:00] brought in and developed to leverage so we can 5X, 10X move, and move forward with, with our organization and, and, and be more productive?
[00:06:10] Speaker 5: Most jobs are a collection of tasks. Some tasks can be automated, some are augmented, but and some are distinctly human judgment, trust, creativity, influence. If companies treat AI as a cost-reduction exercise, they m- may become more efficient but less capable. And the real opportunity from my perspective is to use AI to remove low-value work and expand the capacity and value of the humans that you have within your organization.
[00:06:39] Speaker 5: I think there's a lot of responsibility that lies within my role to see how we could do that as an organization
[00:06:46] Helen Wada: and you touch on that word value, Finesse, because actually that comes down to the heart of business growth opportunity. And, where I sit, where I'm coming from and working with, with businesses that are [00:07:00] constantly drive, whether that be growth organically, inorganic growth, whether it be expanding into new markets, selling more, winning more.
[00:07:10] Helen Wada: You've seen it.
[00:07:12] Culture and Value Skills
[00:07:12] Helen Wada: I'm curious from what you've seen across your, your life cycle of working in these organizations, what are the human skills that matter the most in creating value both for individuals and organizations?
[00:07:31] Speaker 5: I love that. And I'll tell you, it's not complicated. It's very simple. But I'll say in we're talking about culture, so I'll talk about culture a little bit and then I'll talk about some examples. But I think one mistake that a lot of organizations make is treating culture as an HR program.
[00:07:48] Speaker 5: It's not what appears on paper. It's it's so more in depth and everybody's responsibility, especially from leadership. Culture is what leaders consistently reward, tolerate, which I'm gonna talk more about, [00:08:00] and model. So employees watch or, what's happening, and so, to, to really bring in people to feel like they are belonging and that they, they have the empowerment to make decisions, y- you, the, the human-centered leadership means being clear about the standards while remaining curious about the person.
[00:08:20] Speaker 5: Before assuming that someone is incapable or disengaged, act- actually what is getting in the way? Ask that. Do they lack clarity, capability? I really reject the ideas that leaders must choose between caring about people and delivering results. As I said before, I, I think people really want to know what their expectations are, and the best leaders create an environment where people know three things: I matter here, I understand what's expected of me, and I can see how my work contributes something meaningful.
[00:08:49] Speaker 5: And I'll tell you that my commercial example is with, with my current organization, we improved our net employee score eNPS by 40 points in one year, [00:09:00] and that didn't happen by slogans or superficial engagement activities. we listened. We listened carefully, identified the moments that were breaking trust, strengthening leadership communication, clarifying expectations, and creating more meaningful ways to recognize contribution.
[00:09:17] Speaker 5: It's really that simple. The lesson is, is listening matters, but people can see if you're actually making change. And when they do that, then they f- they they know that you're listening
[00:09:29] Helen Wada: it's that translation of the listening into practical action, isn't it? It's, it's actually demonstrating that. And I think going back to what I was talking about, that, that value creation piece, one of the things that w- we often talk, or I talk about, is how you listen with your customers, with those that you want to be working with, with those that you want to be building business with, because this is where we start to get the overlap in the leadership skills, [00:10:00] in the commercial sales skills, and to, to negotiate.
[00:10:04] Helen Wada: Because actually, to negotiate well, to open, open doors, to land new pieces of work, actually certainly in the B2B environment, you're looking at skills that are all about listening. It's about creating trust. It's about transparency. And those are the same skills that you're talking about, that you need to create an organization that is thriving and motivated
[00:10:29] Speaker 5: 100%. 100%. And motivation comes by I feel very strongly, and the numbers don't lie from what, what I've, what I've learned, is that, if, if they feel like they matter, which we're going back to the human piece, these, these are, these are people with, with lives, and they matter they understand what's expected, and they see and understand how what they're doing is contributing to something meaningful.
[00:10:58] Speaker 5: And I, I do think that's the secret [00:11:00] sauce, and that right there builds the trust because people understand where they stand, they understand where they're going, and why they're doing what they're doing
[00:11:08] Helen Wada: and I get all that,
[00:11:10] Proving ROI to Boards
[00:11:10] Helen Wada: So given that y- I work with a number of chief people officers and understand how important it is to, to grow the top line and to also have this human-centered leadership culture, what people struggle with is linking that from a business case perspective, linking it to the board, and I'm curious in terms of your experience, what people can be doing to help invest in, in these skills?
[00:11:37] Speaker 5: Absolutely, yeah. And I, I, I kind of reject the idea that the leaders must choose between caring about people and delivering results. I think they're absolutely attached. Caring about people equals delivering results , and the data shows that. So with with my experience with boards, it's showing that data and, and, and the, the information and numbers do not lie.
[00:11:57] Speaker 5: But again, people are not numbers [00:12:00] and I'm fortunate in my role that I've had the partnership with the CEO and board to really be able to move forward some programs and invest in some really good programs to continue to develop our people. I think there's an ownership and, and responsibility from the leadership to continually do that, have people fill their toolboxes regardless if they're going to stay long term or not.
[00:12:23] Speaker 5: I also think it's a differentiator. So you know, people wanna continue to learn and grow and get uncomfortable and develop and, and I think that's really important part of not just retaining people, but con- continuing to increase their skills for the ROI. When we're talking about AI with all the disruption, I really feel it's the responsibility that we are continuing to train our, our employees on how to use it.
[00:12:50] Speaker 5: Not just responsibly, of course responsibly, but how are they leveraging it within their business, within their areas to make things more efficient and [00:13:00] more productive? Not only are you giving them skills to develop themselves so they now have this on their resume when they leave, right? And that, that's a really, good feeling is like, my company's, investing in me.
[00:13:12] Speaker 5: But also it's helping us grow internally. And so, that, that, that investment in the people, it's, it's 5X return. And, and it's I think that that's really important and I, I also see that it's missed a lot. It's a, it's a box that you check and, and it, it really should be a big focus as not just on...
[00:13:29] Speaker 5: And, and also just the technical skills as they, they grow within their, their technical skills. But also behavioral and leadership and AI. I, I think that's a big differentiator and the key
[00:13:41] Helen Wada: I think those skills are the, the same skills that, that we need in the marketplace. If we're thinking about these frontline conversations, if you're thinking about your commercial leaders, the people in sales, the people leading the business units, actually you need to be [00:14:00] developing the human-centered skills to be able to connect with your customers.
[00:14:04] Helen Wada: The number of times, I hear even on a, we're talking sort of B2B here, but actually as a consumer, when we're just getting the, the telephone bot or the chat that doesn't really understand. Some of it's pretty good, right? But actually, when you're dealing with more complicated scenarios, a chat doesn't work because it doesn't get it.
[00:14:25] Helen Wada: And so that's where the human-centered skills come in so much more now from a commerciality point of view. And, and actually to drive the growth, you need to differentiate because otherwise everything is going to be commoditized
[00:14:40] Speaker 5: 100%, absolutely. And the employees are going to not feel like they are contributing in the best way possible. And if you feel that way, and again, you don't feel like you're contributing to something, the meaning of what we're doing, you're not gonna be happy. You're not gonna [00:15:00] enjoy what you're doing on a daily basis.
[00:15:02] Speaker 5: So there's that, that, that psychological piece, right? It's, it's what am I doing to to continue to learn so I feel comfortable and more confident and empowered in my role? And then that definitely shows, there, there's your EBITDA right
[00:15:18] Finesse Blumenthal: there.
[00:15:19] Getting Buy In Tips
[00:15:19] Helen Wada: You've been really fortunate in your career, Finesse, to work with a number of fantastic executive boards, leadership teams, private equity businesses that you're working with now. There are some people that I, I see struggle with getting that engagement to invest as you would want to. What would be your tips to them?
[00:15:39] Helen Wada: Where, where do I start? Because it's tricky. Right? And investment is hard to come by
[00:15:48] Speaker 5: It is very, very tricky. and actually I feel very fortunate, Helen, because there is something to be said about the partnership with the, the CPO, CHRO, and the CEO, and the [00:16:00] executive leadership team. And, and being able to have a voice I think is really important. I know that seems cliché, but, when you're able to, to come to the table and say, "Look, this isn't my first rodeo first of all.
[00:16:12] Speaker 5: And second, this is the why. This is the why, and let me prove it to you." it's our responsibility as, as HR leaders to show the why and not just come to the table and, and, and say, "This is what we... I think we should be doing." th- why? How is that... Where, where is that hitting the bottom line?
[00:16:31] Speaker 5: And, and I also think it's important too to meet the business where they're at. And I've had to learn this through my career, is that I don't do anything without the co-partnership with the leadership team and the business. And what I mean by that, it's, anything that we do within our people team, it's coming to the lead- the business and the leadership team going, " Does this make sense for you?
[00:16:53] Speaker 5: Is this gonna work for you? And, and how is this gonna impact you in the right ways?" so we can create what we need to [00:17:00] create to move the business forward in the right ways. I think a lot of people miss that piece. Example is performance management. I'm not a big fan of the traditional performance management and, you come into a company and they don't have a strong performance management program.
[00:17:14] Speaker 5: And, as an HR leader most, like, throw something together and say, "This is what we're doing," and that's doesn't work. That doesn't work. And to, to build trust with the CEO, the leadership team, the board, you need to meet them and go, "What, what is gonna be working for you? What, what do you need to make this successful?
[00:17:30] Speaker 5: What's gonna help us thrive? What's gonna help your employees grow and, and be impactful?" And let's ask what we're actually trying to accomplish. And so I think two things. One, explain the why with ROI, with data. I think metrics are really important. Otherwise it's just a, it's a talk track. And two, meeting the business and the leadership where they are, and understanding what their needs are.
[00:17:53] Speaker 5: If you can do that you're going to get a lot more traction and buy-in. [00:18:00] And code builder. Code builder.
[00:18:01] Helen Wada: I, I love that, Vanessa. I think those are, are two critical aspects, but what you've done there, and I think it's a shame really 'cause I'm a, I'm a massive fan of, of people, of doing the right things. I'm ... And I don't necessarily think HR is, but we're not gonna get into the debate, but I don't think HR was necessarily the right and the best
[00:18:22] Helen Wada: Human resources that, that says you, you're just bots and people rather than technology. But really looking at it as a people function that is performance generative, that it's, it's coming at it from a commercial lens, and I think that's the shift, and that's the shift that desperately trying to, to bring into the world with all the work that we do with organizations, is putting commerciality at the heart of doing business the right way.
[00:18:48] Helen Wada: Because I think you're right, unless you can put numbers on the top, on the top, unless you can link it into something that links into the P&L or the growth of the business, actually you will [00:19:00] never get the initiatives off the ground. It will never work. And so it's absolutely critical to bring those together and say, "How do these skills link to ultimately our, our growth of our business and, and the growth of our people?"
[00:19:14] Unconventional Career Story
[00:19:14] Helen Wada: Now, you talked about sitting there with the, the CEO, the board. You also talked about your unconventional career history when we, when we kicked off. And I am just curious in terms of how you've got to where you are. Because talk about the book, talk about Humanwise, the age of the human is about how you show up.
[00:19:36] Helen Wada: And, and clearly you are showing up in a way that you can navigate these often difficult conversations, you can influence others. But what are those skills going back that you've learnt along the way to get you to a position to, to have the conversations with confidence?
[00:19:55] Speaker 5: It's I'm, I'm finally opening my throat chakra to tell the world this, where I have been [00:20:00] ashamed of it for a very long time, so I'm gonna tell you the story. And when I say people are coming out of college not understanding how to build relationships and connections, that's so important when you're, in anything you do, but specifically, when you're trying to move forward in your career.
[00:20:14] Speaker 5: I I didn't graduate high school.
[00:20:17] Speaker 5: Not many people know that, but now they will. And you know what? I'm, I'm okay saying that because I'm really proud of where it took me. I, I traveled quite a bit. Went to New York, LA, trying to figure things out, and when I came back to Atlanta to take care of my mom I met my husband and he and I kind of, helped each other grow, and I went back and got my GED went and got my undergrad, then my master's, then went to Wharton and continued my, my education, right?
[00:20:42] Speaker 5: So I might have started late in life, but when it was re- when I knew what I wanted and I was ready, it was game on. And so when I did realize what I wanted everything that I had learned through my challenges, journeys, you know the time that most people are in college [00:21:00] really lent... I mean, when I moved to New York, I didn't know a soul.
[00:21:04] Speaker 5: I didn't know where I was gonna live. So, those, those types of things where you jump out there and you're not afraid and you build relationships and you're kind of forced to, to, to find your path really lent to my path with, with HR and trying to understand what I really wanted and going after it.
[00:21:21] Speaker 5: But the relationships are absolutely imperative. That's what has gotten me to where I am now. Yeah, 100%. And it's been... I'm really proud of the journey and I'm continuing to grow. I mean, I'm, I'm, as I mentioned, I'm an entrepreneur and I say this because I want people to be inspired that anything's possible.
[00:21:40] Speaker 5: And I believe in, in continuing as a human to develop and grow and iterate and, and put fear aside because there's so much, there's so much that we're capable of. And I did all of this on my own. I got here where I am on my own. It I should say I, there were a lot of people along the way that [00:22:00] supported me, but this was my journey.
[00:22:02] Speaker 5: And so it's, it's now at this point in my life, I'm really excited about starting a few things o- on the side. One is helping people coming out of college, learning how to do, something that's so important that a lot of people don't know to do, business development, build relationships, networking.
[00:22:19] Speaker 5: So that's kind of my trajectory, how I got to where I am now. And again, like, even though I've worked, 20 plus years to get to where I am in the C-suite, it's still not enough. I'm still, like, itching to, to, to grow and learn, do more.
[00:22:35] Helen Wada: It, it's, it's fascinating and, and I love hearing all the stories, Finesse, because actually we, we see when we meet people, you see where people are at right now. But what you don't see is you don't necessarily see the work that's gone in to get there, and the leaps of faith that you've taken and, you know, stepping out of your comfort zone.
[00:22:57] Helen Wada: Thinking now, moving to a new [00:23:00] city where you knew nobody, I, I wonder, I'm just thinking about the work that we do and whether the world that we're operating in at the moment, people are ... It's almost putting c- cotton wool around people, and there's a fear almost that's created for stepping out and doing something different, for fear of getting something wrong, or for fear of not succeeding or, it not going the way you planned.
[00:23:29] Leading Through Fear
[00:23:29] Helen Wada: And I think, thinking back to your story, what can we do as, as leaders, what can organizations do to inspire? It, it comes back to that sort of sales and business development piece that I'm working all the time on with, with, with the clients that we work with, is that fear of stepping out because they might say no, or you might get rejected, or
[00:23:50] Helen Wada: And, and so what, what that happens is that stops us from doing anything
[00:23:55] Speaker 5: So fear is, the worst enemy and we all fight fear [00:24:00] and the what-ifs and the unknown. I, I think it's really important to, as a leader, understand that there's more to a human than what you're seeing in front of you. And, and to, to ... People trust when you build the trust.
[00:24:15] Speaker 5: I tell my team, and I'm just as an example, "You have a safety net. Go out there and get wild. I got your back." "I see you. I see you. I know you. I want to push you further. I wanna see you grow and develop and, and where I can't afford you anymore. Get out there. You got your safety net.
[00:24:33] Speaker 5: Throw things on the wall. Make mistakes. I got you." I think it's really important to, to ... Because you're saying, "I see, I see you." When you say that, you're building the trust with your team, your people, right? They're like, "Oh, wow." I mean, it's so simple, but it's so powerful. And a- from my story, I think I learned a lot of that through, through my way and the way that I, I see the world through my commercial lens, through my leadership lens [00:25:00] is I think because of, of my trajectory.
[00:25:03] Speaker 5: And, and I am able to see beyond, the, what you see in front of you , and say, "I, I see you and I got you."
[00:25:12] Helen Wada: And I love that language, Finesse, not only because it's your language. It's safety net, right? That's you. What, what I might say to somebody is, is different. In coaching we talk about the importance of psychological safety, and, and that's why I am so passionate about the power of coaching skills in this commercial world because I think too often they've been...
[00:25:37] Helen Wada: They're underrated. Yes, they are recognized by a, a small part of the population within, within leadership and within business, but actually there is so much more that these skills that you learn as a coach have got so much applicability in the wider context. That creating a safety net, that I see you.
[00:25:57] Helen Wada: How, how many times in coaching is it about looking [00:26:00] at the person you're working with if it- particularly if it's one-to-one, and somebody just needs somebody else to see who they are, to see under the bonnet and to give them the courage to flourish? And that, for me, is that real intersection or that link between human-centered leadership and commerciality
[00:26:20] Speaker 5: That's it. I, I want leaders to think to themselves, what, have I ever done that? When is the last time that I, I said that? That, I see you. I, I w- I wanna help you. I understand you. I wanna support you
[00:26:33] Helen Wada: What gets in the way, do you think, of people doing that more?
[00:26:39] Speaker 5: I think it's a, a, a, some of, of just not knowing and understanding that how, how much impact that actually brings. And additionally, true leadership is, is that, and I think that's where a lot of companies get it wrong, individual teams, because the focus is on the business, [00:27:00] but your people are the ones that are, are creating the business and bringing in the revenue.
[00:27:05] Speaker 5: And, and, and, and your main role from my perspective as a leader is to see them, is to support them, is to see them grow and continuing to grow because that internal mobility is what's going to, make the company more valuable, make the humans more valuable, and I think that's lost where it's just a focus on, on the business, which, which is important, but I don't...
[00:27:26] Speaker 5: As I said, there's... I don't believe that those are separate. And the focus on your people is essential in understanding what they need, how to get them there, how to continue their support and their growth. That should be 50%, if not more, and I think it's done maybe 10, 20 at that.
[00:27:46] Helen Wada: And, and on the side of the desk and maybe at the end of the day rather than actually that being a c- a core part of the role.
[00:27:52] Targets Coaching and Growth
[00:28:03] Helen Wada: I think Hello going back to something that you said earlier that links very much into this, and I think it links into targets, it links into objectives and outcomes, is often fear targets.
[00:28:05] Helen Wada: There's that, sense of dread when it's like, "I'm being pushed to do more." But actually, if set in the right way and coached in the right way with the right leadership, those targets are there to, to stretch you. I think about my career and where have I grown the most, and it's actually where you've either been given a target or you've set yourself something to do that you just don't think is possible, and that's how you grow.
[00:28:35] Helen Wada: I mean, gosh, take it out of the working world, I ran the marathon many, many moons ago. I probably won't ever do it again, but I did it. And, and giving yourself a target
[00:28:45] Helen Wada: is really helpful, and then you have the right coaching and support. Say how are you gonna get there? Come on." And that's where the motivation comes on.
[00:28:53] Helen Wada: And, and so for me, again, we come back to sales commerciality growth, we shouldn't [00:29:00] fear tough targets. We should fear them if we haven't got the right leadership and coaching behind us to s- to, to support us. And, and so the two have to go together that we create the boundaries, we create the targets, but we also must bring the coaching and listening from leadership together, and that's
[00:29:22] Helen Wada: when the
[00:29:23] Helen Wada: magic happens
[00:29:24] Speaker 5: I love that so much. Absolutely. It, it, with sales, here's your target. Always they'll reach it, then you push it again. And, and to get... Did it continue to push that's as you said, I can't say it any better than what you said. It's, that's, that's the growth and what happens. And, and getting people uncomfortable, that's where the growth happens, being I, I... Have you read The Big Leap, Gay Hendricks?
[00:29:48] Helen Wada: No, but it's on the
[00:29:50] Helen Wada: list now
[00:29:50] Speaker 5: book. No, it's so good, and but one thing that I, I'm always thinking about and striving with, with my team is the zone of excellence is where most people live. [00:30:00] So they work to get to a place where they're really good at something, and they stay there.
[00:30:05] Speaker 5: That's the zone of excellence. Zone of genius is where you continue to push out your higher limit on what y- you don't even know what you're capable of doing. But that's where the focus should be. We real- we, we feel like we're doing so great where we are but you can continue to push
[00:30:22] Speaker 6: to your zone of genius.
[00:30:24] Helen Wada: It, it is that, it's you, you don't know what's behind the next door if you don't push it open, right? And comes back to your story and, and moving to New York and LA, and taking a, a leap of faith to, to see what's behind the door. And in the world that we live in with the uncertainty that we've got, y- you kinda go, "What have we got to lose?"
[00:30:48] Helen Wada: What have we got to lose? And, and actually, I think the world of AI has given us an opportunity to
[00:30:55] Helen Wada: refocus, because the, the human [00:31:00] skills, the ability to step out of our comfort zone, the ability to be curious, the ability to, connect the dots about what's going on, that's gonna be so much more important.
[00:31:11] Future Skills and AI Opportunity
[00:31:11] Helen Wada: I know you're passionate about this. You think about school leavers and those coming through university, it's like those are the skills that people are going to need to succeed, and actually we're still not teaching them. I mean, I've got a 16-year-old. I know your daughter's a bit younger, but it's all text-based.
[00:31:29] Helen Wada: It's all, like, one words or two. And then I have bright, competent children, and still, "Pick up the phone, pick up the phone, pick up the phone." It's like-
[00:31:39] Speaker 5: I have a lot to say about that, when it comes to education policy. But going back to people coming out of college, they're not prepared. They're absolutely not prepared, so that's why I feel like it's really important. There's onus and responsibility on, on organizations and leadership to, to help.
[00:31:54] Speaker 5: The... In my position, very few people are getting hired that don't have that experience. [00:32:00] And, . It blows my mind how there's not, one, learning how to network
[00:32:06] Helen Wada: Yeah
[00:32:06] Speaker 5: and build relationships and AI. But when you... What you said about AI, I really feel like it's, it's leveled the playing field to some extent.
[00:32:14] Speaker 5: And what that, what I mean by that is that if you can think it, you can create it, you can build it. And, if you're, you let your imagination go wild, and whether you are your own business coming out of college, or you have been in an organization for 10 years, you can recreate your role. You can recreate, how you do your work every day.
[00:32:36] Speaker 5: And that's exciting. And, and if people... I think that's the right way to think, think about it because this is an opportunity for organizations to look at work differently, look at people differently. As I said, like leveraging these internal resources and these tools we have, the sky's the limit with what you can do with a business.
[00:32:56] Helen Wada: Yeah. Yeah.
[00:32:58] Helen Wada: It's it is [00:33:00] exciting, and it's making sure that we invest in those human skills alongside the technology that's being invested in. Because those budgets are there certainly for the technology, but we need to make sure that the budgets are available to invest in the human skills to make the difference in, in leadership, in growth, in having those customer conversations on the front line, because that's what, that's what will ultimately shift the dial.
[00:33:30] Helen Wada: Certainly I hope so anyway
[00:33:32] Speaker 5: I, I wholeheartedly believe that. I think that we're- we have a long way to go with the evolution and the understanding on how to leverage these resources in the right way, but I have no doubt that we'll get there
[00:33:46] Helen Wada: And, and that's what keeps you and I in business, Vanessa
[00:33:49] Finesse Blumenthal: Yeah. No.
[00:33:52] Top Tip and Closing
[00:33:52] Helen Wada: Um, I'm sure we could, we could go on for hours. There's so much more that we, we could talk about today. But I- it's been [00:34:00] really wonderful to have you on the show and hear some of your journey and story and, to the wonderful work that you're doing, commercially at the top of organizations, but putting people at the heart of what you do.
[00:34:13] Helen Wada: I won't let you go easily. I always ask our guests for one top tip and one question. You know a good coach loves a good question. But what's one top tip you would offer the listeners today, and one question for them to reflect on having listened to our conversation?
[00:34:30] Speaker 5: Oh, wow. Okay. I, I would say one tip, lot to unpack, but I would say for leadership to ask themselves how much time do they actually spend understanding their people? And be real, be very honest with yourself. If you were to say, "I spend 100% of my day X," what percentage are you spending on listening and understanding your people?
[00:34:57] Helen Wada: And what's the question?
[00:34:59] Speaker 5: I'd [00:35:00] say challenge, - challenge your people today. Set, go set some bodacious goals. Think out- think outside the box as far as what's happening next. Everybody has their goals that they're gonna set. Tip is take it one step further with your team. Set some s- set some crazy goals
[00:35:20] Helen Wada: Love it. Love it. Set some crazy goals and think about how much time you spend really listening and understanding your people. Thank you, Finess. It's been an absolute pleasure to have you on the show. I wish you well, and good luck for the rest of the year
[00:35:38] Speaker 4: Thank you too
[00:35:39] Helen Wada: Take care. Bye-bye
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